Shej

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11/01/2021 10:18 pm  #21


Re: DUNE

Kokipy wrote:

Yes, sadly, that was my take this time thru. I found the first three heavy going, ponderous, portentous,  murky- oddly enough I liked God Emperor better than the first three, and Heretics of Dune even better, because things are finally, somewhat, explained, and the focus seems to be more on the story than on some mystical philosophy which seems to have been LSD- inspired.  And in Heretics there finally seems to be some kind of “noble purpose” that becomes a motivator, without which none of the various groups have any morality. The individuals have values, but the institutions lack any such thing, it seems.
But Herbert sure loved the Duncan Idaho character- he shows up every time 

This is most discouraging to hear. I haven’t read it since I was 21, and had been thinking of rereading. Reminder to self: Rereading your favorite books from childhood is a risky proposition 
 


One world -- or none
 

11/02/2021 9:15 am  #22


Re: DUNE

Did you know that Dune was originally published by Chilton, the company best known for all those car repair manuals?  They were the only ones willing to take the risk. FH had submitted it to over 20 other publishers that rejected the manuscript.  Also please keep in mind that this is a work that is over 50 years old, many of its themes are now widespread throughout current science fiction.  One fell in love with CJC because her works have a similar density in plot and world building.

 

11/02/2021 9:53 am  #23


Re: DUNE

I loved the first Dune book, but had enough when it was done and never really wanted to read any of the sequels. Am I wrong to think that the first one was enough?


http://strengthofthehills.tripod.com/hanilanguageandculturepage/

The date I joined the original board: 12/04/2002
 
 

11/02/2021 11:03 am  #24


Re: DUNE

I don't believe so, Spence.  I read the ones that Frank and Beverly collaborated on after Dune, and after Frank died, the series was kind of undertaken by his older son, Brian and Kevin Anderson.  They wrote the books based on Frank's notes. There were "prequels" and "sequels" to Dune, many of them do not take place on Arrakis, and that planet is only mentioned in passing. 
I always felt Herbert's main focus was on how societies (whether it be human or animal) adapt under extreme stressors.  I started that conclusion when I read "Under Pressure" (also known as "Dragon in the Sea"), but other people believe he was focusing on ecological aspects.  I can see their points, too, but my feeling is still that it's how societies react and adapt to stress, after having read as far into the series as I have.  I stopped at that point, because I felt that they were getting to be much too far from the original idea and more and more into oppressive societies.  Maybe that's their intent.
 


"Those who can give up essential liberties in order to purchase a little extra security deserve neither liberty nor security." - Benjamin Franklin
"The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane." - Marcus Aurelius
 

11/02/2021 11:15 am  #25


Re: DUNE

HRHSpence wrote:

I loved the first Dune book, but had enough when it was done and never really wanted to read any of the sequels. Am I wrong to think that the first one was enough?

Kokipy’s report suggests the one may be too many 😭


One world -- or none
 

11/02/2021 11:57 am  #26


Re: DUNE

Having read Whipping Star and The Dosadi Experiment, featuring Jorj X McKie and the Bureau of Sabotage, I would agree with the societal aspects of his story.  Stopping after reading Dune is certainly acceptable. FH did say that parts of Messiah and Children were already part of the plotted storyline by the time Dune was published. Serialized works have long been science fiction mainstays, you read them or not as the case may be.  There are more than enough works out there to be read that you have to choose wisely where to spend your time.

 

11/02/2021 2:52 pm  #27


Re: DUNE

I remembered liking  whipping Star and the Dosadi experiment (Jorj is a lawyer, iirc)  even on rereads some years back, probably because I am a lawyer. I still think there is a lot to be said for the first three Dune books, even though I found them annoying this last time. It might just be my time of life, I don’t know. I liked Heretics and Chapterhouse a bit, but am really thinking I can walk away from the rest of this universe at this point.
having said all of that, I stil think the movie was pretty good. I enjoyed it a lot. 

     Thread Starter
 

11/02/2021 5:16 pm  #28


Re: DUNE

Kokipy wrote:

I remembered liking  whipping Star and the Dosadi experiment (Jorj is a lawyer, iirc)  even on rereads some years back, probably because I am a lawyer. I still think there is a lot to be said for the first three Dune books, even though I found them annoying this last time. It might just be my time of life, I don’t know. I liked Heretics and Chapterhouse a bit, but am really thinking I can walk away from the rest of this universe at this point.
having said all of that, I stil think the movie was pretty good. I enjoyed it a lot. 

McKie is qualified to practice law before the Gowachin bar, but I don't know that he's considered a lawyer for human courts.  There is a short story where he sabotages Bildoon (the Chief of BuSab) with a Jacuzzi stim, as a means of temporarily replacing him, and pleads his case just like a lawyer. 


"Those who can give up essential liberties in order to purchase a little extra security deserve neither liberty nor security." - Benjamin Franklin
"The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane." - Marcus Aurelius
 

11/02/2021 5:32 pm  #29


Re: DUNE

Kokipy wrote:

I remembered liking  whipping Star and the Dosadi experiment (Jorj is a lawyer, iirc)  even on rereads some years back, probably because I am a lawyer. I still think there is a lot to be said for the first three Dune books, even though I found them annoying this last time. It might just be my time of life, I don’t know. I liked Heretics and Chapterhouse a bit, but am really thinking I can walk away from the rest of this universe at this point.
having said all of that, I stil think the movie was pretty good. I enjoyed it a lot. 

Having now researched the film a little and realised just how good an ensemble cast it has, I've decided I will risk a theatre to see it on the big screen when it gets here.  And I will definitely will try to reread the first book before I do so.
 


It's a strange world.  Let's keep it that way.
 

11/04/2021 11:14 pm  #30


Re: DUNE

Surtac wrote:

Kokipy wrote:

I remembered liking  whipping Star and the Dosadi experiment (Jorj is a lawyer, iirc)  even on rereads some years back, probably because I am a lawyer. I still think there is a lot to be said for the first three Dune books, even though I found them annoying this last time. It might just be my time of life, I don’t know. I liked Heretics and Chapterhouse a bit, but am really thinking I can walk away from the rest of this universe at this point.
having said all of that, I stil think the movie was pretty good. I enjoyed it a lot. 

Having now researched the film a little and realised just how good an ensemble cast it has, I've decided I will risk a theatre to see it on the big screen when it gets here.  And I will definitely will try to reread the first book before I do so.
 

I will be interested to hear how you find the book all these years later
 


One world -- or none
 

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